Getting Head Low & Collection

I'm going to be showing a my 4 year old in like 18 days, and she kinda has her head low. its a little bit higher then level, not too much though. I would like her head just a tad bit lower! I have a training fork, do you think i should use that? and when i get her to trot she goes kinda faster than what i would like, then when i try to ease her slower she gets into the walk! any ideas? and how do i get her head lower for my halter classes?

THANNKS TO ANYONE THAT GiVES ME ADViSE! :D

Woo...okay...

To get her head lower for halter classes...just practice with a chain lead, when she has her head too high, gently "snap" the chain...you'll get a feel for it. She's going to need to be relaxed if you want her head low...so practice will help that.

To ease her gaits...sit deep in the saddle, push in the stirrups with your heels (heels down toes up :) ) and say easy...I use easy to go down a gait, because "ho" or "woah" asks your horse to stop all together.

Were there any other questions...I hoped that helped!

Thanks! so to get her head low when im riding, i should use my training fork. That is what i used on my other Appy.

Training fork...hmm...I'm not firmiliar with that, we might call it something different where I am, what is a training fork?

some people call it a running martingale right? Or is it the same as a tie down?

no its not like a tie down...it ...well i'll look at see if i got a picture of me using it...hold on a sec!

all the pictures i have, you can't really see it. but anyways it has to rings that you run each rein through. then a snap at the end so it looks like a Y and that snap clips under to the cinch. get what im saying? That's probably confusing!

do you want your horses head to be lower under saddle as well? or just in hand??

if you want your horse to be round and have a headset you need to work on impulsion, engagement, tracking up, transitions.. basic flatwork.. you cannot use martingales (or a training fork) in flat classes, and even if you could, its a false headset and judges HATE that.

I wouldn't use a training fork on a four year old. Just apply equal pressure on your reins, kinda grab them and hold the pressure, when she drops her head and "gives" release the pressure and say good girl, grab up the reins again when her nose comes up wait, and bump with your legs, she is going to go faster but that's okay, wait for her head to drop and release the pressure again. this takes time and patience. As for the trot to fast, when she picks up speed ~ turn her on a 90 degree, do lots of stops and pick her up to a trot again ~ fast......not a walk then a trot ~ TROT. As soon as she goes to fast again either turn her, what I mean by this is pick up her shoulder, so that she's not leaning in, round her barrel and let her relax on the straight away again. Do lots of stops and pick up that gait again, then stop and pick up the gait with no hesitation. And, as soon as she has cadence, grab your reins up and hold and bump with your legs, when that head goes down release the pressure. These are two separate training things here, so pick one day and work on head set and don't worry about her speed, then the next day work on her speed/cadence. Hope this helps. Good luck at the show!

THANKS! yeah that really helps!!! im will DEFINATLEY try that! :D

Yes, I agree...I wouldn't use a training fork...I've never heard it called that before either, hmm, interesting! :)

I'm not sure why you'd want her head low in a halter class? Halter class....head high. Showmanship head level....balanced. Nonetheless, when you have her in her halter, put the lead chain under her chin and hold the pressure.....when she gives and drops her head release the pressure and praise her. Everytime she is just standing doing nothing, ask her to drop her head.....while saddling, just before walking out, just before you do something with her ask her to drop her head and then proceed with the request. A horse that has a low head is a relaxed horse and is more apt to listen to what your asking.

Thanks everyone. and what I ment was the showmanship, didn't mean to confuse you guys, I don't want her head really low for showmanship, but level with her back! =]

well i think a training fork is like a running martingale but a training fork is western. its hard w/ younger horses and i dont think u can show in a training fork.
hope this helps in anyway! and good luck at the show!
____________________________
~jaime~
~!some horses are so polite when your jumping they let you go first!~

Yeah you can't show in a training fork, but if i could get her to just have it a tad bit lower i would be a Very Happy Camper! =]

the problem is if you use the martingale to get the head lower the second you take it off, guess where the heads goin?

the problem is if you use the martingale to get the head lower the second you take it off, guess where the heads goin?

Right back up! I'll download a picture from yesterday..that like right where i want her head...

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j29/appy_lover/meandjaden436.jpg

this is perfect for me...but she raises her head in the trot..any ideas?

Hi hon. Her nose is poking out in that picture, you want her perpendicular. Flexing at the poll. That is why she's popping her head up at a trot. When her nose is out like that.......grab a hold of your reins until she drops her head and tucks her nose in, then release the pressure......Now before you ask for a trot, do the same as above get her trotting, grab a hold of the reins again, bump with your legs until she "gives" and drops her head, as soon as she does this, release the pressure ~ let go of your reins. You'll have to do this for quite awhile before she gets it, but when she does....as soon as you pick up your reins and squeeze with your legs she'll "give" and drop her head. Even at a stand still make sure she drops her head before she moves out/picks up her gait. She sure is pretty, I'm sure you guys will do awesome at the show!

THANKS LOVELOPIN! and everyone ELSE! I'll definatly try that!! :D

well good luck at the show!
_______________________________
~jaime~
~hanoverians are my heart, thoroughbreds my soul, but, JUMPERS equal me!::cowboy:: ::gallop:: ::bolting:

For the problem with your horse trotting to fast:
What I do is start trotting in circles.-Kind of like cutting the arena in half or even less. Then slowly bring your horse out. And if you use 2 hands for reining do whats caleed a see-saw where you pull very slightly back and forth while your troting. That also slowly'em down.

Okay thannks guys!!! :D:D:D

I agree with pretty much everyones suggestions, but i would NOT see saw to get your horse to slow down at the trot or drop it's head or anything. Never see saw the bit back in forth in their mouth it hurts their mouth and there is no reason for it. Your horse is young she's only 4 so she's still developing muscles to keep collection. How long have you been training her? I would do a lot of walk halt back up transitions and then move off with impulsion and the same thing at the trot, this will create impulsion from her hind end and will lift his shoulders. Also practice doing long and low with your horse, bring her into a smaller trot circle keep her on that circle and she will relax. you will feel her dip her nose down when she does this let her go as far as she wants too, for as long as she wants to as long as she stays on that circle, this is stretching her out and is teaching her that she can relax at the trot with her head low, Now obviously you don't want her dragging her nose on the ground in the show ring but this is just to teach her to relax at the trot, once she understands that go back out on the rail and trot around if she gets speedy with her head up then just bring her into a small trot circle again and then work back out on the rail. She may not be perfect in 18 days but she will have a good start to being an awesome show horse for you!! Good Luck!

Well I use a merlin snaffle,it was meant for doing things such as that.-One of the easiest bits you can find in my oppinon.(My horse was previously abused and has problems with bits)

:D Howd the show go?? did you place in any of your classes? I cant wait to hear all about it!

-jaime::rasberry ://\\

hey did you have your show yet???
I have never heard of see-sawing a bit to be acceptable, even with this merlin snaffle? do you have a pic of it, bonnie? I am curious to see it, I can't find any info on it.

Anyways, a better way is a half halt, where you take on the reins a bit, and at the same time apply leg. this causes them to collect themselves up a bit more and refocus. Also pick up or look through some riding books (dressage books will most likely have this) and read about training a horse to follow your rein length. I haven't the love for typing to put it all here, but most books have this I think. The circle idea someone mentioned is also good for practicing a slower, relaxed trot.
I am not familiar with Western Pleasure, but I think its basically the same as English pleasure classes now just western tack. careful she doesn't get her head too low. I believe to have her head parallell with her topline is perfect.

If you already had the show let us know how it went!!!

if you want your horse to develop a slow trot or a slow lope without a big fight and a bunch of training ideas that you don't know how to do. watch Clinton Andersons "Cruising" video.
It's REALLY simple to do it's fun and you see fast results.
Basically your horse will self teach, always the best way when they figure it out themselves.
However your horse has to know how to one rein stop before you try it. Not so much at the trot, but at the lope. Esp. a young horse that may or may not be well broke enough to already have a really good whoa on it.
My mare has an exceptional whoa( sometimes better than mine, lol) I tried this with her at the trot and the lope and it works GREAT! If you want the details watch the video, or PM me and I'll run it down to you.
when you get your horse slowed down, then you can work on collection while moving. It's to impossible to do both at once if you horse is to fast and you really need to try and get your collection at the stand still if you can, but sometimes it's easier if you do have some speed up, like slow trotting or even walking. With movement you should be getting impulsion and sometimes it's easier to collect then.
The suggestions above about picking up your reins and holding till you feel her drop her head a bit are great. It works well, takes a bit of time, but well worth it in the long run. Short cuts in training like those forks are false and not solid foundation work.

Hi, I'm 14 years old, and I break and train my own horses, and my Equestrian Team Coach suggested using the "See-Saw" method, on my 14 year old gelding for WP classes, and ALL of the horses I've used it on, learned to collect themselves and really use their hindquarters underneath their bodies, and slow down, it was unbelievable, and as long as you are gentle when pulling the reins, you won't hurt the horses mouth. Another way to get their head down is to put a rope over their backs, go through their fronts legs, and hook each end of the rope to each side of the bit, but make sure it's not too tight. When they move, it will alternately pull on each side of the bit, then when they pick up their other leg, it will pull the other side, as long as it's not tight, it's very gentle, and I got my 5 year old mare to trot with her head nice and low (but not too low), then I just moved on to riding like I regularly would, without the rope, and she did SO much better.